Minutes of Meeting
Meeting held upstairs in Town Hall
Wednesday – August 8, 2007
Those attending: Town Manager Edward Samson, Selectmen Leo Enos and Administrative Services Manager Becky Newton.
Regular Planning Board Members: Chairman Fred Emerson, Vice Chairman Steve Young, Joe Hoey and David Rexford.
Alternates attending: Justin Carter
Excused: Aurore Hood, Les Hilton, Claude Reed and John Brooks.
Absent: Leon Rideout
Other attending: Jim and Ann Marie Dubreil, Ray and Annette Dubreuil, David Fuller, Barry Lunderville, Leo Rideout, Sr., and guest, David Parks, Lucy Wyman and Tom Dubreuil (of Guildhall, Vt.)
The meeting was called to order at 6:30 P.M. by Chairman Fred Emerson. He welcomed all to the meeting and roll call followed.
Justin Carter was appointed as a full voting member for the meeting.
Initial Business:
To review and approve the minutes of the July 11th meeting. Steve Young questioned the name of the Forester that had been at the meeting. The Secretary stated that that was how his name appeared on his business card. After no further discussion a vote was called for to accept the minutes.
A motion was made by Steve Young and seconded by David Rexford to accept the minutes as written. A vote was called for and the motion carried.
Public Hearings: None.
Major Subdivision: None.
Minor Site Plan Review:
Case #688 Raymond Dubreuil, Jr. – Applicant requests to
construct an outside movie theatre to include 28” x 20” projection building and
50’ x 25’ movie screen 12’ off the ground. (Tax Map P5 Lots
50 & 51). To review application for completeness. Discuss
and vote on final approval.
Raymond
Dubreuil spoke to the Board and expressed what he had planned to do. The
fencing around the area will be blinded so that car headlights will not disturb
the neighbors or cause a distraction to traffic. He plans to have large trees
around the area also so that there would not be any reflections. The lights
installed will only shine onto his property.
The lights will have shades/baffles to direct light down and onto Ray’s
property. He proposes parking for 100 – 150 cars. The brook that runs along the
land will be barricaded off so that no one can drive
into it or otherwise disturb it. Movies to run on Thursday
nights for children. Friday and Saturday nights would have 2 movies and
Sunday night only 1 movie.
Chairman
Emerson asked the Board if they had any questions for Mr. Dubreuil.
Joe Hoey asked
about the trees.
Ray said
that he has installed
two large trees there now and he plans to put in more.
David Rexford asked when
he planned to start.
Ray said
that he had hoped to have it up and running in two weeks.
Leo Enos asked about the
traffic flow.
Ray said
that he thought it would be ok as all of the area is grassy except for the area
by the trailer. They could park 30-35
cars across the brook. A culvert bridge is already installed.
Leo Enos asked how
long the season would be.
Ray said
that he was not sure yet, the weather would also be a condition that they would
have to deal with. Could be seasonal. Not sure if he could operate in winter due to
fog, etc.
David Rexford asked if
there was a path across the brook for the people to get back and forth to the
snack bar.
Ray said
that they would use the same passage way (culvert-bridge) as the cars would.
Steve Young asked if
there were any wetlands in the area that they are planning to put the movie
theatre.
Ray said
that there is some on the left hand side.
Ray believes the area in question can be driven on even though it is
wetlands as long as you aren’t hurting anything. He got the land for a reasonable price and
has been working with his family to put it all together.
Leo Enos asked
about rest rooms.
Ray said
that for now they will have portable ones. He has a building there now and he
will convert it into restrooms with 4 stalls for girls and 3 stalls for guys.
Leo Enos asked
about what time the movies would be letting out.
Ray said
that depending on the weather and whether they run one or two movies that night, they should be getting out around 12:30 – 1 o’clock.
Joe Hoey asked if
the sound would only be coming from the radios in the cars and not from
speakers that hung on the outside of them
Ray said that was
right.
Fred Emerson said that
he noticed that the screen would be 37’ high and the town only allows for 35’.
(25 feet high on a 12 foot pole) Would he be able to shorten the screen or if
not he would have to go to the Zoning Board for a variance for the height.
Ray said
that he will be as flexible as possible with the town, but he will need a pitch
for the cars so that everyone can see the screen. He agreed to go with a 10 foot pole for the
screen.
Noting that there was nothing further from the Board at
this time Chairman Emerson then asked if any of the abutters wished to speak.
David Parks said that
he had 3 reasons why this should not be granted.
l.
Causeway Street cannot handle additional water and sewer connections.
2. The
Town just added gravel over the old
pavement and
otherwise re-did the street and there are already potholes. Road cannot handle
more traffic..
3.
Raymond Dubreuil has filled in wetlands which is
against the law.
Mr Parks also stated that the has a letter saying the he
(Mr. Parks) could not fill in that area when he owned it and now they are
telling Raymond Dubreuil that he can.
This could end up in a court case Linda Magoon said the DES has “bigger
fish to fry”. Mr.Parks has contacted a lawyer.
Mr. Parks sold the land to Raymond Dubreuil. Fred Emerson reminded Mr.
Parks that wetlands are State jurisdiction.
Mr. Parks stated that if he pursues the matter, wetlands will make Mr.
Dubreuil take out the fill.
Lucy Wyman spoke and
quoted from the Town History that
Lucy had pictures
of the poles that Mr. Dubreuil has already set for the movie
screen taken from her bedroom window.
She said that the area in question has always been wet. The recent filling in of the wetland means that
the land does not absorb the water as it has done in the past. The town has spent a lot of money increasing
the size of the Summer Street and
Ray said
that in the pictures that Lucy Wyman showed you could see where the junk was
removed and all the
improvements that he has made in the area.
David
Parks and Lucy Wyman both said that they have not heard back from the Wetlands
Board and would like the Planning Board to hold off on making any decisions
until they have heard from their letters.
Joe Hoey asked
where the cows were.
David Parks said that
the Wetlands Board took an aerial photo of the land and it shows where
all of the wetland is.
Raymond Dubreuil said that
they could exchange words back and forth all night regarding things not really
concerning the matter. He stated that he
has permits for everything that has been touched.
David Parks asked about his
hooking up to the town sewer.
Ray said
that everything that he has over on the street is already hooked into the town
system. He mentioned that
Joe Hoey asked if
it was zoned Commercial.
Fred Emerson said that
it was zoned Commercial/Industrial.
Barry Lunderville said that
he was coming in to ask to erect a radio tower 20’x20’ and he felt that the
Town would be irresponsible in granting something without all of the permits in
place. Would be irresponsible of the
Planning Board to approve the site plan without Raymond showing he has wetlands
approvals. The wetlands would be the issue and when they come to inspect it if
they don’t like what they see they will make you dig it up. If the Town approves and
unlawful use, it’s going to be in trouble. If all the land is wetlands and it is filled
in where do you mitigate. You will need
to show the permits for whatever you do.
David Rexford asked if
Raymond Dubreuil was going to tie into Town sewer. Raymond said everything is
already hooked into town sewer. He has 6
connections – and there will be 7 when he’s done. Ray has already installed sewer under the
culvert and would be willing to make this route available to the Town to
connect to Town sewer into
David Rexford also said
it is up to Raymond to get his wetlands permits.
Barry Lunderville said that
wetlands infractions are recorded and act just like a lien on the
property. You cannot sell the property
until fixed. He was also worried about
noise on Summer Street.
Noting
that there was no further discussion from the abutters it was asked if anyone
from the public wished to speak.
Ann Marie Dubreuil stated that the
Board is talking about all of these wetland issues and Raymond is here for a
movie theatre. Wetlands are a state
issue.
Lucy Wyman stated
that the Planning Board can dictate what should be done as when people come to
the Board – such as planting trees, installing sidewalks, etc. Lucy said the
Board should do a better job at negotiating things for the Town of
Raymond Dubreuil said that
he has done a lot of work on the street at no cost to the Town. He has ditched
the road, lower culverts and is putting in another culvert for drainage in the
area.
Lucy Wyman asked Ray
what Linda Magoon said when she met with him.
Ray
replied that she said to get the theatre going.
Joe Hoey asked if
he had all of the permits.
Raymond
said that he has the permits for the trailer, for the screen & the road. He
also needs to remove some stumps that he buried.
David Rexford asked if
he had a permit for the parking lot. There was some confusion on this point, as
Annette believed he did have a permit for the parking lot as part of the house
lot approval. Raymond seemed unsure
Edward Samson stated
that
It was
asked if he had a permit for
Raymond Dubreuil said no he had one for
trailer.
David Parks said that
when the trailer was there, it was only 25 feet off the road and there is fill placed on the lot way beyond the 25 feet.
Joe Hoey asked if
there was a permit for the 3.15 acre piece. He was told no as it already had
the trailer on it.
Ray said
that he paid for a Soils Scientist to come assist with the permit for lot 50
and the soil scientist said it was ok.
Edward Samson asked how
much of the proposed development is on lot 51?
Raymond Dubreuil answered
that the camera building was on lot 51, parking on lot 51 and movie screen is
on lot 50.
David Parks stated
that in 1970 there was ash filled in there.
Leo Enos said that
he would like to have a report from a Soils Scientist on
Lucy Wyman said that
the permit was for 2 trailers and now there are 3-4 and there is also a house
there now.
Fred
Emerson that those things were not the issue before the Board.
Lucy Wyman stated
that the Zoning Ordinance does not really address how these decisions affect
one person and what recourse a person has when a development adversely affects
an abutter. What can an abutter do? For
Example, if this development lowers her property value, what can she do? Lucy’s
zoning (agricultural) rubs up against a commercial/industrial zone.
Becky Newton said that
there are several things you can do. You
could file a tax abatement, you could file a civil
suit or you could file an appeal against the Board’s decision.
A motion was made by Leo Enos and seconded by JoeHoey that the Board do a site visit.
Fred Emerson stated
that he and Steve Young had been to the site on August 8 and discussed the
wetlands on the left hand side.
Barry Lunderville stated
that is this something that the Town wants.
Tom Dubreuil spoke and
said that Raymond has been paying taxes on this land and if it is turned down
he has the right to go back to the Town and get his money back. There is high water in many places but that
doesn’t make it wetlands. He is only improving the land that he owns. Tom made
suggestions about other uses on the property such as a pig farm.
Raymond Dubreuil said that Lucy
was in favor of his getting the house and bridge but he had all of the permits
necessary.
Annette Dubreuil spoke and
said that they are trying to make it a family oriented activity, there isn’t a
lot to do in the area and they will be selecting movies for all ages.
Ann Dubreuil wanted to
know if they were voting on the application being complete.
Noting
that there was not further discussion from the public the discussion was closed
and was open to the Board only.
Joe Hoey said he
was not sure that the application was complete without a wetlands permit. Joe
thought that lot 50 was ok, front part of lot 51 was ok but the back part of
lot 51 was what was in question.
Leo Enos was
looking for a sketch to scale with measurements for things such as fence. How
long would it be? How high would it be? These were his questions.
Fred Emerson said that
he felt that the application was complete as there was a narrative answering
many of the questions.
Lucy Wyman said that
she still wanted to know if he was going to have “piped in” music and how Ray
planned to addressed the honking horn issue.
Edward Samson said that
the Board has to hear the concerns of all those concerned. The Board has the authority to set
conditions, such as impact on water and sewer, condition of road or other
things that feel necessary. The Board
also has the authority to have the developer bring the road up to specs. It was asked if Raymond could bring in some
pictures of lot as of today. He stated
that he would.
A motion was made by Joe Hoey and seconded by David Rexford to continue the hearing on Wednesday Sept 12, 2007.
It was noted that there was a previous motion on the floor for a site visit and soils scientist report. That motion was called for a vote and the motion carried.
The motion to continue to Sept 13th was then called to a vote and the motion carried.
There
will be a site visit on Tuesday August 14th at 5:30 P.M. with
various Board members – there will be no discussion at the site, questions may
be asked of Raymond Dubreuil.
Members
should provide a list of questions about the development to the applicant as
soon as possible to allow him to get their questions answered prior to the
September meeting.
A survey
from North Country Council was circulated to board members who were present.. Surveys should be
returned to the Town Office.
Noting
that there was no further business to come before the meeting a vote was called
for to adjourn.
A motion was made by Leo Enos and seconded by Justin Carter to adjourn, a vote was called for and the motion carried and the meeting adjourned at 8:05 P.M.
Respectfully
submitted: Approved:
Sandra
E. Doolan – Clerk Fred
A. Emerson
Chairman